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Who wants to be dictated to by the State on how you support your children what, how and when?
Whilst many views float around arguing for and against child support, most decent fathers and parents would argue the issue is not whether or not they wish to support their children, but rather the often unfair conditions imposed upon them.
Simply, it's an attack on the nature of a father's freedom and how he best wishes to raise and support his children in the many different ways a responsible father can, which are often more effective and benefical to a child than any 'slap-bang' instrument of government and statism can ever be.
For a father going through separation/divorce, experiencing the loss of family and children, horrendous false allegations, litigation, uncertainty of where your children are and how they are doing, often causes ill health, work and life instability in so many ways. Also, the effects from not having a fully functioning and emotionally present Dad in a child's life can be equally, if not more devestating as their development can be hindered considerably.
Then if that isn't bad enough, along comes an assessment from the Child Support Agency (CSA) for an outlandish sum of money based on your capacity to work at the highest rate when you were fit and able and on fire, which is possibly a stark contrast to where your financial position is today, or will be in the future if you are unable to recover from the upheaval of a traumatic separation that's often compared to a fate worse than death.
From 2006 CSA powers in Australia have increased to not only garnish your wages, but directly withdraw from bank accounts any amount they deem appropriate, siezing assets of any sort to pay the often highly questionable and unjust debts. As Fathers are assaulted with such draconian measures, one can only feel a sense of dictatorship giving rise to a totalitarian society not a free Australia causing fathers to unite and fight for their rights and freedom.
As there are many issues surrounding child support and the effects upon fathers, children and families,
Child support, via the CSA is for maintenance of the child
parenting orders, via the Family Court, for access
and no, the two are not linked. It would be great if the CSA had the power to cease payments based on one partner violating a parenting order or by taking it upon themselves to restrict access (where no parenting orders exist). In this way the system is too unfair and one sided
Based on what you say, it is unethical behaviour, and Lawyer will get looked at and could sanctioned.
I was in court today for a DV breach, I had the hide to speak to my wife in court and then give her lawyer a spray. Apparently lawyers should be beyond reproach. Why is it then that they are permitted to recommend DV proceedings to assist their parenting case?
Flow on the effects of CSA intervention when your children have been taken away, you no longer have a home, your employer is filtering money to CSA so that your ex-partner can live the life of Reilly and ironically give all of your hard earned to the spittle licking cockroach lawyers, WHO STARTED THE WHOLE PROCESS IN THE FIRST PLACE!
I recommend pointing your aggression toward lawyers first. They are the real problem. Let's have a 'Public Outing' of all inappropriate actions by lawyers.
I had a lawyer that withdrew as my representative so that she could put a contract on my house, that was being liquidated. Gee, conflict of interest or downright unethical...let me think?
CSA / Family Law - multi billion dollar racket destroying families and creating the new" stolen generation "and creating" domestic violence".
Just the other day I heard on the radio that university studies have shown that homosexuals due to discrimination of "gay marriage" and homophobia are falling into depression. Well well well .Welcome to the real world our homosexual brothers and sisters. Because of our wonderful political scum we have 21 fathers commit suicide each week and 3 women are murdered each week. So please enjoy your marriage equality. Where as the rest of us heterosexuals just stay calm :) because it will never change .And as someone has here said it's changing for the fathers, pls get a reality check , causer judging by the comments people post here, the number of people getting screwed vs the winner is irrelevant. ..5 more years and counting. ..
If they have said the DPO has been lifted, request confirmation in writing. Make them work for their jobs. From what I've seen, most of us just give up. DO NOT GIVE UP. that's what they want you to do.
you have options, you can offer a bond and they cannot refuse. The bond must be returned when you return to the country. Don't pay them to clear the DPO, they are liars and they will leave the DPO in place. I've neverexperienced such a lying pack of weasels in my life.
Section 72D have a read. you need to see it in writing if the DPO exists.
A departure prohibition can be applied to non aussie passports. CSA woulf not say there is one if there is not. It is not a passport stop...it is an order under law that means customs could not let you board a plane and for those who do get to Airport the Federal police escort you back from the place..essentially tell you sorry you cannot fly.
CSA chooses the conditions under which they remove it. If they believe you can pay lump sum that's what will be asked for.
Based on your full payment seems like best option as you don't want your holiday wrecked.
From what i inderstand,if there is a DPO in place it simply means you will need to enter into a payment arrangement before being allowed to depart the country. So just get to the airport early.
This means you got the s107. I hope you applied for s143 at same time so she has to pay you back.
What you sre talking about here is that the judge found she was not entitled to apply as the court found presumtion of parentage was not me making case invalid from start date.
Hope you also got the second decision.
The court ruled in my partners case and stated that the test is to be done on a set date she never turned up ( she was told what wold happen if sge didnt turn up )so the court has ruled no more csa payments and his child support case is to be stoped. His x has not turned up to 2 court app either
When you lodge the s107 which associated to dna the law says child support payment stop but it is still assessed. CSA cannot collect during this time. If he is dad but he will be required to pay contact or not so just be aware.
Mal yes CSA will tell you if they DPO. The parameters are CSA believe this is the best enforcement approach in your case. Not every person gets DPO.
he was denied all visits to his kid since the boy was 2yrs old
Went throu everything to see him the x left the state and moved around when ever my partner found where they were. Long story cut short the boy is now 13 and my partner has taken her to court and won no csa payments at all till a dna test is done. CSA can not give anyone visits to their kids only the courts can do that. All csa do is get the money from the paying parent.A court order can have csa stoped if the mother does not give access to the father. So best anyone can do is start court and get to see your kids that way. family law has changed to the fathers side and does state that having the support of both parents ( not just 1 ) is better on the kid
1. will i be advised if this is in place or will it just be a 'surprise' at the airport?
2. Can DPO done for any reason or what are the parameters? i have a very spiteful ex and i recently told my son i was going to China for work. I dont want to have to deal with this infront of my work colleagues........
3. I have a debt of about $860. it is an amount in dispute. she rorted me but thats another story. I know i'll have to pay it eventually I just dont want to until Christmas for the benefit of my son. apart from that i pay the prescribed amount every month.
any advice appreciated
I aslo think we need to rally the troops and waste the CSA's current evaluation process. That absolutely needs to happen.
For example: If you are being denied access by the custodial parent, and have attempted to engage this parent through the mediation process, and the other party is unwilling to co-operate. Then you should be able to request that your CS payments be suspended until visitation/custody or whatever can be determined and re-evaluated. Fairly.
There is shitloads more but anyway, I'm Clint, and these are my contact details; firstname.lastname@example.org 0438-906-304.
i am interested in your DVO hearing. am flying to Qld next week to attend one myself. like to know about the procedure etc.
have you got an email or phone i can contact you on ??
Can give hints and tips on writing all applications and addressing other issues.
Reads very similar to custody and child support battles being fought between estranged parents. Wake up Australia, and seriously consider reform to the Family Court, custody and child support regimes ...
When you say you found the ATO helpful, did they give you financial statements or something to that effect? I'm sure I can find her ABN if I tried but she is declaring an income. She is either not working much or fudging the figures. Once again the CSA delegate wouldn't even look into it, stating she has been a low income earner for years so what has changed, my reply was the kids are now in school so she can go back to work!
I have 50/50 care and I do earn more than her and she most likely can't earn as much as me. I just want her to pull her weight and work full-time like I have to or at least be assessed as working full-time and her new man can support her choice of lifestyle instead of me. I know she would still get some child support of me but my money is for my kids not her lifestyle. But CSA seem to think she is entitled to not work and still get money. What a joke.
Im curious as to the comment of "Just dont do anything dodgey it will come back to haunt you" Are you referring to gaining information by deception or something along those lines? Clearly dealing with CSA defies logic and reason, so if there is an example of something some of us may feel is reasonable but in there eyes could be deemed "dodgy"I'd appreciate the insight.
I have just lodged my appeal to them, and expect the first response from them in approximately 4 weeks.
do you have an email I can contact you on initially (don't want to ask you for a phone number in a public forum).
Lyndon, what you say is dead right. Understand the law, don't settle for the CSA standard line and use the system as it has been created. The AAT is not the final line in the sand by the way, you can also lodge a Federal Court Appeal.
Every person that has fallen victim to the CSAs' neglect of both receivers and payers should lodge appeals with the AAT. If we swamp the system with the appropriate number of appeals it will grind to a halt and something will be done. I implore you all to follow the process and make them work for their money. As it stands (and I say this with the experience of many hours on the phone to these 'minions'), they believe themselves to be above the law and beyond reproach. I have also lodged a complaint with the Ombudsman which is on-going.
Media next stop!
1. Tax return for adjusted taxable income
2. Provisional assessment
3. What the parents have told the CSA of their income.
What I want to understand is that why aren't both parents treated equally if one hasn't reported their income correctly.
Isnt it the responsibility of both parents to report a change of their income?
If one parent updates the CSA on their income changes where the other parent doesn't even bother then why would the parent that had done the correct process have to back pay? I understand that it is the amount that you have to pay to support the children however if the negligent parent hasn't followed due diligence then shouldn't it be their problem to solve.
I get annoyed at this as some people have raised it in the past, after separation / divorce your move on with your life and budget accordingly - yet an ex partner could be late with their tax return or not even do them after years and then you get hit with a large back pay debt. They have dealt with the amount of money that they had been getting for the children that long why would a back pay amount make any difference.
It would be great if a legally qualified person would read these forums and offer some pro bono advice - I wonder if a statutory declaration to the CSA stating that you have fulfilled your obligation to advise them of your income and should the other parent not update them in a require timely fashion that you aren't liable to any back pay.
There are options and approaches to best support the factual situation. The CoA under reason under reason should always consider both parents income.
When applying for her income to be considered under Capacity to Earn (you must establish her business was an attempt to avoid or influence your CS). Capacity to pay touches on the personal benefit derived by the business to her - these are under reason 8 but are very different arguments.
Mike if you are going to appeal you may need to spend some more time on what it is you are raising - so that you can address the points in a way that will encourage a more in depth look.
My child support was recently increased from $149 per month to $1590 per month.
I am currently objecting to the decision, however, in the meantime I am expected to pay this amount. Which I can not.
Does anyone know how to apply for a "Stay Order" ?
Im a Govt employee with no investments (family court and CSA made sure of that) so its all straight fwd. I do my taxes on time and CS payment is taken straight from payroll dept. I have had 13 changes to my payslip over the last 2 years as a result of ol mate being allowed to do as she pleases. Try running a budget or planning anything when a new envelope with changes lobs in the mail unexpectedly. It seems the irresponsible parent gets rewarded, male or female!
My wife broke down crying when my objection got declined because we we work hard, and live within our means, but ultimately we are now funding the exs decision to leave steady high paying employment to start a business.
My oldest son turns 18 in 2 months and my payments only drop from $400 to $350 pfn. My other son is 14. How the hell did they calculate that!
Paul is correct and SSAT and AAT will use same rules to come to decision but it may be better or worse (depending on your role) than what CSA did.
CoA should not be based on accusations but foundation. Rob if your ex-partner has a business there are ways to better write t he application and please note if CSA refused it you xan object and then gonto external appeal.
All any external person can do is support you to put your best argument forward but at each point the decision is the delegates.
The key difference to date is that the AAT asked for a financial statement from me up-front. CSA never requested this of me, preferring to believe the garbage fed to her by the MOTHER.
I would encourage you to push the CSA to the limit. They will at some point have to refuse your application at which point you are entitled to go to the tribunal. Remember, if you've hidden anything the tribunal may actually INCREASE the support that you pay.
You need to understand that the CSA are a law unto themselves because of the very poor wording of the Act. Basically, the Registrar is allowed discretion in making an income variation decision and delegates that authority to a handful of peanuts within the department. My experience to date is that no knowledgable persons actually assist with this determination (and I'm talking about qualified accountants).
Delegates are making decisions on anything from profit/loss statements to balance sheet analysis and even anticipated dividends, whether your ex gets them or not. I've done a particularly good job (or so it appears) of pissing off every person in the department so I've made a rod for my back. If there is any way that you can work with them you have a fighting chance. Of course it would help if you sacrificed a testicle to the cause...maybe that's where I went wrong?
My suggestion is don't give up, that's what they rely on because they are swamped with complaints and appeals, this is of their own doing of course.
My position as it stands is that they claim that I owe circa 30k, I now pay nothing and they've tried a garnesheer, placed a Departure Prohibition Order on me and they continue to increase my liability through their 'automated' reviews. This truly is a mindless process, the government should be ashamed and the 'public' needs to know the real deadbeat dad story, as opposed to the bullshit that we've grown to accept.
you can also object to the decision of the person who reviews the initial decision - this goes to the AAT / SSAT.
I am currently going through this process and am at the AAT phase. I got some wins through the objection process, but think there are other things that need to be considered.
come minus 34k in expenses.
I put in a COA reason 8 as I assumed she has shown a capacity to earn 70k. She wasnt fired or made redundant, just left.As anticipated, CSA rejected this and declined my COA. Even though she has had 9 jobs in 10 years (proven through her Linkedin profile). Never fired or let go, just walked. When she does this, my payments yo yo, without warning. I have a new family and try to budget responsibly and plan for events such as a newborn, mortgage, holidays with children etc.She has a history of this and has had to back pay me once before, but not after I had to fight through the process Have I got a case to appeal? Her response was tit for tat bitterness and full of non facts without any evidence. But CSA case officer agreed. My kids actually miss out on things now when with me because my disposable income is now minimal.
Yep you will do what you have to in order to survive - well done and good luck. No good waiting for the 'system' to adjust to suit us payers.
I am leaving the cuntry soon to get my life back in order. Leaving my three twisted (parental alienation syndrome) kids here.
On a broader note this is an interesting article that would be of interest to us 'payers/losers" in regards to so called 'proceeds of crime' Law. Turns out a QC has stood up to the AFP and handed the crims a free-kick.
Can you imagine if we payers' had the same legal rights under the Family Law ACT ha - never happen! but the article shows you that crims are better protected than us. Too mind this makes me imagine that the 'wigs' are looking after their 'well healed' friends on the other side. Choose your friends wisely !
Good luck all.
i am interested in your DVO hearing. am flying to Qld in the next couple of weeks to attend one myself. like to know about the procedure etc.
have you got an email or phone i can contact you on ??
I had been in contact with CSA regularly about my case, or should I say, the case my bitter ex had slapped me with. I had for some time after she prohibited me from seeing my son maintained my payments. Then one day I thought - f**k this! This is ridiculous. Constantly on and on about money but can NEVER not ever assist with visitation. "We just take your money. Justified or not". Get f**ked. I want to see my child and be an active part of his life and you're telling me that this, this is more important?? Are you actually deranged? Yes. You are. And you are causing far more deaths by suicide than the already alarming rate of domestic violence issues which end in female deaths. You absolutely should be a-f**king-shamed of yourselves. Now, understand that I have always either over-paid or paid the correct amount for ten years. My son is 10. And I have on numerous occasions stated to the CSA "I just want to see him, then I'll continue paying" - simple right?
Just this morning, in the wake of a recent court mention whereby I was defending to the best of my abilities a fancifully fabricated DVO - also preventing me to be near my son or his school - I get this.
Passport cancelled and $2000 withdrawn from my account. And not one linked to a card - oh no. This was deducted from a separate sub-account.
But, do I get to see my son now?? Ha! I imagine she'll have a nice new spray tan, new shoes, lots of happy smiles on fb and probably a well earned holiday. That's how the CSA look after kids. I'll be withdrawing the last of my savings today and after speaking with my current employer (who's equally livid about this ridiculous situation) have arranged other less electronic means of distributing wages.
So again, to the CSA as a whole - a big fat middle finger to you. And I hope you all have an absolutely horrendous cunt of a day. Eat a dick!