Child Support Discussion Forum

Child Support — What does it all mean?
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Who wants to be dictated to by the State on how you support your children — what, how and when?

Whilst many views float around arguing for and against child support, most decent fathers and parents would argue the issue is not whether or not they wish to support their children, but rather the often unfair conditions imposed upon them.

Simply, it's an attack on the nature of a father's freedom and how he best wishes to raise and support his children in the many different ways a responsible father can, which are often more effective and benefical to a child than any 'slap-bang' instrument of government and statism can ever be.

For a father going through separation/divorce, experiencing the loss of family and children, horrendous false allegations, litigation, uncertainty of where your children are and how they are doing, often causes ill health, work and life instability in so many ways. Also, the effects from not having a fully functioning and emotionally present Dad in a child's life can be equally, if not more devestating as their development can be hindered considerably.

Then if that isn't bad enough, along comes an assessment from the Child Support Agency (CSA) for an outlandish sum of money based on your capacity to work at the highest rate when you were fit and able and on fire, which is possibly a stark contrast to where your financial position is today, or will be in the future if you are unable to recover from the upheaval of a traumatic separation that's often compared to a fate worse than death.

From 2006 CSA powers in Australia have increased to not only garnish your wages, but directly withdraw from bank accounts any amount they deem appropriate, siezing assets of any sort to pay the often highly questionable and unjust debts. As Fathers are assaulted with such draconian measures, one can only feel a sense of dictatorship giving rise to a totalitarian society — not a free Australia — causing fathers to unite and fight for their rights and freedom.

As there are many issues surrounding child support and the effects upon fathers, children and families,

Share your opinion and experiences about the pros and cons of child support,
lifting the veil on a most horrid part of family breakup!

Start writing a comment now...

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    By: gary from qld, au on December 9, 2016 @ 3:33 pm
    Hey guys I have just money garnished from my account is there any way to dispute that the money is and was being used for business working capital and can I get it back
    By: Will from Qld, Australia on December 9, 2016 @ 2:55 pm
    Well CSA are going to take half of my pay from work and then leave me cold and dry with my new family any ppl know how to stop it??
    By: SHERC from Qld, Australia on December 9, 2016 @ 12:59 pm
    I have just been hit CSA for a second case even though both my children are to the same mother.This woman has encourage my daughter to run away from her mother to stay with her so that she can claim child support of me. I contacted csa on this matter and they said is that we ae hear just to take care of the money,and not to care about the fairness. Not only that have stung e as two seperate cases so instead of 24 percent for children im paying 36 percent.
    By: SG from Western Australia, Australia on December 8, 2016 @ 11:20 pm
    Hay Alison,

    can you please get the money out of Andrews account.

    The blood suckers will find it and DRAIN you dry.
    Try to think a little smarter, I don't think we need to be much smarter to beat them.
    Just cleaver about our personal stuff.

    Stay strong and be proud!!

    By: SG from Western Australia, Australia on December 8, 2016 @ 10:53 pm
    Hay DJ
    know how you feel mate.

    Tell them all to get stuffed or fucked if you like and take it out of my tax in July.

    See if you can get your money paid into a family members account instead and go on the fuck'n dole.

    COME ON!!

    By: SG from Western Australia, Australia on December 8, 2016 @ 10:40 pm
    What all the people in this twisted system need to remember is its an industry. How many gov jobs are created here for people that should be in full time care??
    I've been screwed from the pointy end of the pineapple and she is now going to go for spousal maintenance even though I'm not working. She can make up any crapp she wants and they believe her. She had a VRO taken out to remove me from the home/home office destroyed the bus we had and forced me in to taking a small % of our assets.
    Who ever gets the VRO first wins!!
    That what the Luck'n useless lawyers say anyway.
    By: DJ from WA, Aust on December 8, 2016 @ 7:19 pm
    This organisation CSA has to be stopped somehow. They can't go on praying on vulnerable fathers who are already in a depressed state. I've been reading the stories that are all similar to mine. CSA taking money from wages and or accounts without your consent leaving you with not much to live on. It's not right, they have to be stopped and the whole system overhauled before anyone else is pushed over the edge
    By: Neil Bennett from NSW, Australia on December 7, 2016 @ 8:02 pm
    Allison I just read your story again and want to add.....
    They CANNOT drag you into court. You have NOTHING to do with Andrew's situation, married to him or not, and if CSA say that to you they are BLUFFING and LYING to you.
    1470. By: Neil Bennett from NSW, Australia on December 7, 2016 @ 7:55 pm
    They took your money under a 72a application because it is paid into ANDREW'S account. It is NOT a court order
    If it was your account they CANNOT touch it. The simple way is to have your wage and Andrews wage paid into your account. But you must realise that any of Andrew's payments can be traced but the CSA need a COURT ORDER to access YOUR account. It must ONLY be in your name. Another way is to have a Company account IE Pty Ltd ABN, Directors ( must have 2 directors ) and all that goes with running a Company using the Company as a firewall between yourselves and the CSA. I know its stressful....I have been there. Just remember to get creative with your accountant. It will cost your more in legal fees if you use a solicitor to get your money back. The only people who win out of this are solicitors ( Leeches ) and ex-wives.
    If Andrew can be paid through the "Company" then they cant touch his wage as well.
    Don't both need to be healthy for your family..... treat it as a cat and mouse game.
    By: A from VIC, Australia on December 7, 2016 @ 12:32 am
    D Nguyen,

    The point at which income no longer affects child support is currently $178,140. So, unfortunately this is way to high.

    The amounts are specified here:
    By: mic from vic, aust on December 6, 2016 @ 6:46 am
    Alison send them a conditional acceptance notice requesting proof of claim, without prejudice, via reg mail. Do a followup letter after 14 days.

    I am quite happy to pay any financial obligation I may lawfully owe on condition that the following is provided:

    1. Validation of the debt, ie. actual accounting;
    2. Verification of the claim, ie. invoice signed by a living man showing value has been provided or sworn affidavit; and
    3. Certified copy of the contract binding both parties, comprising the eight essential elements including wet ink signatures.

    Please reply with requested proofs and substance to be received within (14) days, failing such, it will be deemed that no lawful debt obligation exists.

    Only a guide, change it as you see fit.
    By: Alison godwin from Western Australia, Australia on December 6, 2016 @ 1:25 am
    Hi guys !
    I'm French been in Oz for 4 years with Andrew. He's Australian .
    He has had 2 kids with his ex and needs to pay $ 16,077.47 to child support before tomorrow ...
    We basically barely afford to pay for our house loan with both our wages.
    My salary goes Into Andrews account.
    CSA took 1,300$ 2 weeks ago, leaving us only $106 to live on for 2 weeks..
    I'm on antidepressant because of immigration issues and Andrew is loosing it with talking to CSA.
    CSA said they will take legal action against us to recuperate the full amount of money ...
    We really need psychological and legal help...
    Do any of you guys been in the same situation ? How can we find support to get through this?
    Someone told me we could ask Andrews superannuation company for the money...?
    Thanks for your time
    By: D nguyen from NSw, Australia on December 5, 2016 @ 8:43 pm
    New to CS payments, it seems the amount they make you pay which doesn't factor in your current suitation is ridiculous. Don't put me wrong, im willing to pay but i still have to live and make ends meet. Does anybody have any experience with the reform? Im i right in saying for payments calculations taxable income should be capped at $104 702?
    By: D nguyen from Nsw, Australia on December 5, 2016 @ 8:23 pm
    Hi..has anyone come across and understand the child support reform especially stage 1 which i think was effective as off july 2006 in regards to the child support cap.

    "Stage 1 of the reform was introduced on 1 July 2006. From that date the minimal annual rate of Child Support was increased to $320.00 and is indexed annually to the consumer price index. The minimum payment again increased on 1 January 2008 to $339.00 per annum.

    The Child Support cap was reduced from $139,347.00 to $104,702.00 so that the income of a payer over $104,702.00 will not be taken into account for the purpose of calculating their Child Support liability. This change was in response to research suggesting that high income earners were paying Child Support in excess of the cost of maintaining their children."

    So child support assessment can only be worked out on $104 702 max right for paying parent?
    By: Shell from Vic, Aust on December 5, 2016 @ 8:15 pm
    Jen you can try for another reassment and issue a drs report we have tried this
    The reply to us was his first family comes first.
    Every time we have put in a reassessment they have been rejected.
    CSA will do your head as well
    They are nothing but arseholes.
    Look up your local council website and see if there is free legal advice
    I feel for you Jen. But it will never end.
    Be aware as well ALL your information goes straight to his ex.
    So much for privacy laws
    By: Jen from Victoria , Australia on December 5, 2016 @ 6:03 pm
    Can anyone help us??
    My husband has reduced his hours to share care for our one year old son so I can return to work. He is also suffering stress and has a medical certificate.
    His ex wife works part time and reduces her salary each year by less then 10%, csa consider this minimal and no issue. We did not have an issue with this and paid the assessed child support as required.
    Now my husband has reduced his salary she did a reassessment and he has to pay full amount against his full time salary not reduced hours salary. Will the dr certificate and caring for our son have any weight??
    By: Shell from Vic, Aust on December 4, 2016 @ 8:30 pm
    Now we all understand the saying
    You get less time for murder. Csa create family violence. Eddy I really feel for you kiddo as far as csa are concerned what the woman says goes. Dads are molesters, violent etc according to them when in actual fact the majority of them make wonderful parents. I'm a woman and have seen this for don't see many single mums drive crap cars, broken fingernails and grey hair
    Do you?
    By: Rob from VIC, AUST on December 4, 2016 @ 2:44 pm
    Hey Selina,
    Sorry to hear you have been through all that. It's good hear from females as it proves the system is not all one sided and is broken badly. I also know a female that was ripped by the system and nothing she can do. The govt just don't care that they ruin peoples lives. It seriously needs review but all too late for many, unfortunately. Best regards.
    1460. By: Selina from Queensland, australia on December 2, 2016 @ 5:17 pm
    Hi Guys, I feel your pain. I was married to someone that only ever could hold part time job and only for a little while because he always pissed people off and he was always better than everyone else anyway according to him. So I have been on both sides of CSA. So one child with him and one with me. Totally not ideal, I had the daughter and he had the son. I was paying him to support my son due to my wages and his lack of work ethic. The son was dumped off to me one day about 1 year later and the EX moved interstate for work. So I had both kids, CSA told him he needed to pay $44 per fortnight (he did running a business doing cashies), which to me who cares, put it aside for the kids cars right (16 & 13 years). I paid all tuition fee for private school for both kids over $30k, not one dime from him to assist. So over time he didn't pay, he racked up over $2k of debt, I gave CSA, Bank account details, super details, where he lived, what car he drove but nothing, didn't get my money back (don't rely on them). He took my son one day from my house without my knowledge, when I was at work and drove him interstate, then called me to tell me, at that point apparently it was son's decision to go and he was almost 15 so court won't care cause of his age. So EX and I agreed that we wouldn't charge each CS and that I would wipe the $2k debt from CS which I did. I put my tax in June just gone for the previous year and CS decided to send the paperwork showing my new income to him (why do private collect need to be sent this ???). So then I get a threat from the EX one Monday night, that i either pay $200 per week or he will force CS to get me to pay $322 per week, even though we were to look after each child, I demanded to get a Binding Agreement and he said he would go an get CS to get the whole lot $322 and needed an answer now. So stupidly I agreed (Private collect) thinking at the time I was doing the right thing even though I had looked after and spent more on those kids than he has his entire life, I was concerned that something happened to him as he sounded desperate and thought he may have been in trouble, so rang him, I agreed over text to pay the $200 but on the phone (Which i didn't record) agreed that I put the money into my sons accounts, despite our previous agreement. Daughter turned 18 years and move out to live closer to campus 2 months ago. Son was unenrolled from school by X without my knowledge even up today he's 16 yr 6mths. So this week,CS contacted me to tell me that he is now claiming CS for $322 + 3 months backpay $3k, the $200 that I was paying week, the X told CS that only $100 was for child support, so now they won't credit me for the other $100 per week. X has been working under the radar/ABN/Cash the whole time, he is claiming he earns $9700 pa and he hasn't put his tax in for about 3-4 years. Seriously what a joke. This system is broken, I feel abused, like a lot of you do and can't think that this system is about the kids, this is about support money hungry EXs, what kids needs $322 per week to live, it about supporting the leach you unfortunately attracted and then they on your back for years until your kids hit 18, Ex thinks who needs to work. I only have 67 weeks to go and I am free. People, get everything in writing and voice record everything... I have learnt the hard way and I really do know how you feel it's just not a fair system.
    By: Neil Bennett from NSW, Australia on December 1, 2016 @ 8:37 pm
    My son was 9 years old and jumped on a train and called me when he got lost to come and get him. That was the 1st time. 2nd time he almost made it to my place but the railway police caught him and made both of us wait for his mother. The third time he ran away from school and made it home....I rang his mother and told her I wasn't brining him back this time and he was staying.
    The point mate is if you do the walking No one can stop you. Your father won't get into trouble and neither will you.
    Good luck with what you choose.
    By: Pike from SA, Australia on December 1, 2016 @ 6:13 am
    Eddie, there is no legal age mate it's just a level of maturity, when you're ready you will know. Whilst attempts at it happen everywhere, nobody has a right to control the free will and self determination of another - i think they refer to that as slavery.. Be strong in learning who you are... my son at age 11 got up and left his mum with his feet. It took a few goes, like 5, as his mum or the family court didn't want to acknowledge it but in the end they had no choice. All the way through he kept a r'ship with both parents according to what he chose and that's the way it naturally goes i guess, whether we like it or not...keep love in your heart and you will be fine
    By: Rob from VIC, AUST on December 1, 2016 @ 3:27 am

    I had the court tell me during divorce proceedings that 14 is the age for someone to decide to live with Mum or Dad. So Dad cant get into trouble if you choose to live with him, he is doing nothing wrong... :)
    By: Eddie from NSW, Australia on November 30, 2016 @ 8:28 pm
    I hate CSA i want to move to my dad's but apparently my dad and i cant do anything about it if we try to ask the government to move to my dad's i can't because they only listen to the mother. and in Australia the legal age to move out is 18! Anyway the reason i want to move out is because i HATE living with my mum she is very mental in the head it's causing me a lot of suffering. If my dad or i asks the government to move out my mum might tell the government that the problem is my dad and they might take him away from me or even worse take him to jail. So basically i have to live with my mum until i'm 18 :(.
    By: A from Victoria, Australia on November 30, 2016 @ 7:20 pm
    Kris, haha good point. My email address is anonymous though.
    By: Kris from nsw, ZOG on November 30, 2016 @ 6:54 pm
    A , simple work for cash.
    Questions like yours i would not answer here as those csa fks surely read this site.
    By: A from Victoria, Australia on November 30, 2016 @ 12:23 am

    My situation is that I am going to be working as a contractor with my own Pty/Ltd entity.

    I am wondering if there is someone who could provide advice about how to minimise CSA payments in this scenario.

    I have read the law and a great deal of related information, but I would like to talk to someone who has been successful in a situation such as mine in structuring their affairs so to minimise CSA payments. Presumably this would mean legally minimising taxable income.

    I have read in this forum the idea that a father could refuse to contract with the CSA as their powers may depend upon common law. This reminds me of 'Sovereign Citizen' type theories about law that I don't personally think would be successful.

    What I want to do is legally structure my income so that child support is minimised.

    Please contact me by this email address if you can be of any help or could refer me to someone such as a tax lawyer who could help me.

    By: Rob from VIC, AUST on November 28, 2016 @ 10:54 am

    I had a VRO (called AVO here) removed once but the x had to agree and we both had to go to court to have it removed. She claimed she would give me another chance, while I said the whole thing was BS in the first place. It took months and I got dragged through the meat grinder and all the legal people made $$ out of it. As far as i know that's the only way you can. Other than that is to sit it out and start your own new life. Don't give up and best you can do is hope the kids come back one day. I lost one son through all the BS who hasn't spoken to me in 7 years... For children to lose contact with a parent is very sad but the legal people don't care because they made $$ out of it and have unclean hands... Such is life.
    By: SG66 from Western Australia, Australia on November 26, 2016 @ 11:01 pm
    Anyway on Monday I'm going to lodge the forms in family court regarding the kids and even if I do have to have supervision I don't care.
    I was a full-time Dad I only worked 22 hours a week and cook cleaned did breakfasts washed clothes did the school drop off's you name it I was there, we had the home office.
    OK, enough going on SG.
    Anything you can think of that might help me get the kids and get rid of that f---- VRO. I know she will fight me all the way and hard too. She isn't scared of lying through her teeth by the way. At first, I'm going to offer 4 weeks of supervised visits min of 6 hours per week.
    Then I'm going to ask for the kids from school pick up Wednesday till school drop off Friday morning and then the next week school Friday afternoon to Monday morning school drop off, so 6 nights a fortnight and that way I don't have to see her too.
    The VRO is the other. I have been told that she wants it to stay on her because her friends and school mums and dads might find out what really happened.
    1450. By: SG66 from WA, Australia on November 26, 2016 @ 11:00 pm

    Because of that and trying to find a place it took 11 weeks to get the internet on and some office stuff from her it completely stuffed the business we had. She even told the two JP's in the court that my 13-year-old saw me taking pictures of my penis and sending them a friend. She also has texts supposed from the kids at 9.30 at night saying they are frightened of Daddy and even a letter from my 11-year-old saying how frighten she is, however, there are 3 different sets of handwriting in it.Sorry, I'm going on a bit. The only thing I can say is it is a rubbish and it was all to do with her getting sprung shifting money out to her old man. And that is another story a blood sucking long one. So the thing is I was set up to stay and set up for a big fall by them both on promises of many things.
    I have a letter from her saying I could supply the kids a phone so they can talk to me which I did and I saw all the kids on the day before my 4-year-old's birthday 22 May for two hours with their godmother present and gave them the phone then.
    All the kids were crying at the end and wanted to come with me. The next night I called them with their godfather with me on speaker phone and my 9-year-old son said he had the day off school because he felt so sick because he missed me so much. After that, she turned the phone off and threw it in the cupboard then wrote my solicitor a letter saying she wouldn't vary the VRO because I had upset them so much. And that's just a little bit of the B--- S--- she has done along the way. She even went to Bali for 5 days and left the kids with her parents.2. She got the kids put on the VRO out of spite the whole thing is vexatious and it takes so long to get to court and defend it, bloody just over 6 months and to have the feeling that I wouldn't even know if the kids are alive or dead, just helpless and the whole system suck's.The VRO was all on her say not proof or even hearsay, her lying her say and I lost my kids because of a spiteful mother that got caught loving the wrong family, her father.
    3* They sent the older kids to the psychologist and so I found out because the older two said they were a little frightened at times they can try to keep the kids off me longer. They really did their homework before I wasn't of any use anymore.
    All emotional hurtful things as they can all the way, I got the VRO a week after my 50th and on good Friday which was our 16 anniversary and I was taking the kids to their Nanny's that weekend for an Easter egg hunt.
    Sorry going off again :)

    By: SG66 from WA, Australia on November 26, 2016 @ 10:54 pm

    In that time, (16 years of marriage) we had 4 children ages are 4,9,12,14, with the 9-year-old being the only boy. They are on the Violence Restraining Order as well, she told the magistrate that I was taking the kids away and she was frighten for them. She knew I was taking them for a Easter egg hunt at their Nanny's for the weekend in Toodyay in WA just over a one hour drive away.
    It has been 8 month now that I haven't really seen them and the Violence Restraining Order court date wasn't until the very end of September then she had a barrister for it and tried to make me out to be a fuck'n monster. Then the fuck'n court system could hear it in one day so another 4 weeks later we had day 2 and at the end of that day find out that the magistrate didn't bother to read the original transcript from when the VRO was granted is just fuck'n unreal. So he has reserved his dissension until the 5th of December

    We were also just prior to me being turfed out in the process of purchasing a business.

    I have just settled the financial side of things with only just enough money to cover the requirements for the bank as it will help me look after the kid's futures and she said I could see the kids once it was out the way.

    I was happy to settle, just to get rid of her and now I will have a fighting fund to fight for the kids and it was probably better than going to court. She got 70/30 of the combined superannuation and 60/40 of the cash that was left from the sale of our house in 2014. I was told it wouldn't get much better than that and now I can move forward.

    She wanted me to sign a minute of undertaking that the Violence Restraining Order stays in place and she will take the kids off it. We had already sent one to her with the Violence Restraining Order removed but with the same undertakings as the Violence Restraining Order (not that I want to talk to her anyway).

    Anyway, there is a bit more involved in the past to get into for now but its hard to keep it simple and short.

    Point form might help:

    1. The VRO is complete B--- S--- she has even told the godfather of our kids she only used it to keep control of the kids, money and get me out of the house and I have read the transcript and the whole thing is full of crap. We had a home office at the time and she was asked in court if I had any tools of the trade at the house. With only 30 mins to get out, I could only grab a few thing for work.The god father was chick'n shit and wouldn't go to court to help me.
    By: SG66 from WA, Australia on November 26, 2016 @ 10:46 pm


    A bit of background for you.

    Back in March, I was thrown out the house (ON OUR 16TH ANNIVERSARY)with no warning and I have even received letters from the wife saying I could stay till June. I found $30k missing TO HER FATHER from the bank account and also, via internet banking, found out that she had transferred all the funds into a bank account in her name only from our joint account.

    Just prior to that, I also found other amounts to her father and that she had also bought him a car and paid lawyers, mortgage, car loans and other items for him. It all added up to around $1.5m in the end over our 16 years of marriage but most of it since 2010.I was turfed out on Easter Friday 25th March, after being at work all day and even sending her a text asking where she would like to go to dinner for our anniversary>
    Fuck me what a DC I was.
    By: DM from WA, Australia on November 26, 2016 @ 4:03 pm
    So a mistake was made with my tax return that said I earn $14000 more than I actually do. I rectified this with ATO. CSA have just replied to my attempt to have the income reflect my actual and not the mistaken one. Their reply is that they will not change it and will continue to assess me on the higher mistaken income !!???
    How this makes sense is beyond me. Taking money I do not have.
    Merry Xmas CSA
    By: Kris from nsw, ZOG on November 26, 2016 @ 9:46 am
    Hi to all paying parents, csa/family flaw multi billion dollar racket destroying families and creating the new "stolen generation" and domestic violence.
    My ex chooses not to work full time, as she has a great life with her sugar daddy. So i looked into form 8a capacity to earn, and again more smoke n mirrors. This form 8a wants to know everything about me ,pages and pages of shit, like your income,possessions, houses,cars,marital status what colour undies i wear etc, for WHAT?. All i want is for them to look into to her capacity to earn.
    Everyone beware this is in my opinion another trap of csa fks.
    They want to know everything about me so they can at their discretion determine that im just whining,and maybe even to raise your amount, cause you may have inherited your grandfathers knife collection.
    This fking formula is supposed to be based on both parents income,right. So why dont they actively pursue her like they do me.
    Happy white ribbon day fellers.
    And male suicide is just a trivial topic, not worth any ribbons
    Rot in hell all solicitors and lodge politicians.
    By: LAT74 from WA, Australia on November 25, 2016 @ 3:37 pm
    Pauline Hanson and the One Nation Party have policy in place to audit the Child Support System and the Family Court. In line with 2nd Family being penalized by the system and the rorting that goes on with ABN Holders. It is own the One Nation website.....someone somewhere ought to be able to get enough people together and form a collaborative argument that the system is fundamentally flawed! Everything is linked to Mygov so once in the system its almost impossible to get out! I feel for the mums who get nothing, I loathe the fathers that pay nothing and do everything they can to "cheat" I am all for supporting my daughter but not at the cost of my other family! Something needs to be done! It is not a fair system, all the websites encourage an independent agreement with the mother or father but some either want to punish the other or realize they are better off using the CSA, where is the incentive to not use them?! Someone needs to galvanise everyone and take this to the next level...
    By: robin from New South Wales, Australia on November 25, 2016 @ 11:33 am
    Im a mum and have to agree with you CSA are doing the same thing to me .My x owns a ABN and 3 business but doesnt work doesnt do his tax nothing BUT owns a house goes on holidays brought a new car for himself and his new wife all with out a job so its MY FAULT cause Im not doing a thing to get money I gave up as well being the caring bitch I am its not far on him to support his kids that he helped make. Get a job CSA told me and leave him alone he has no money WTF do they think I do all week 80hrs weekends 2 jobs and Im not doing enough to support my kids so I went to court still going throu court. CSA told me once a person has a ABN its not their money its the company money and they cant go after a ABN holder
    By: Paul from Qld, Australia on November 24, 2016 @ 9:23 pm
    AJ, Laurie and all others concerned. The key problem is not the individuals within CSA, although they certainly exacerbate the problems. The legislation is what does all of the damage. I don't have the Act in front of me but the essence of all decision making is that regardless what formula is used, the Registrar has the 'discretion' to decide the amount that you pay and also retains the right to delegate this authority to anyone that they deem fit, even the humble cleaner. No disrespect meant.
    Until we form a united alliance and fight the legislation we will never win. Yes CSA are making fundamental life changing decisions with no regard for the rights of our children and yes, we are drawn into protracted battles with them and others. My list is impressive, I've spent more time in court and studied more law than most lawyers in the past three years. If we are truly frustrated enough to take action, suicide is not the option. We need as much support as we can get. We need a member in the upper and lower house as well as state representatives and it needs to start now. I wish that there was a quick answer but everything to date has been bandaid solutions. Start searching out politicians that are sympathetic to the cause and post their details here, have every pissed off 'payee' send letters of support and get some real action happening.
    By: AJ from W.A, Australia on November 24, 2016 @ 8:05 pm
    Laurie Mills,

    It's interesting to hear things from a woman's point of view who is on the sharp end a bit like us guys are. Personally, I believe that there should be a royal commission into CSA, not that any good would come out of it.

    But yes, one of my key gripes is that they work out their formula on gross earnings.....who the hell gets their gross earnings? If I did, I would not have a debt to the CSA.

    Personally, I see this whole thing as the federal government taxing us all twice, and earning more from the interest on that money. Given that, I doubt that it will ever stop.

    But the thing that gets me SO fucking angry, is how people with their own business do not get fully audited. Example; even though my ex is now a teacher, previously, she was a graphic designer with her own business (I think she still has said business, but has hidden it somehow). But anyway, in the years prior to her becoming a teacher, her earning on paper were..........$5,000 per year!

    WTF? People would not get out of bed in the morning for that, but CSA accepted that as a figure? How fucking stupid are these people? I only have about another 2 years of it left, that is my only saving grace.
    By: Laurie Mills (femaile) from Qld, Australia on November 24, 2016 @ 7:36 pm
    Hi everyone
    Sure is a lot of pain expressed in this forum. I'm perhaps one of the few females who has been victimised by the CSA in "reverse".

    My ex husband refused to pay Child Support, for a couple of reasons: his money is his (self centred), addictions are expensive, he needs to be a victim, the CSA made an error in calculations and we have 3 children so 18%x3 off gross earnings just about put him in the poor house.

    I don't believe CS should be off gross earnings - no "normal" family pays the children before the tax man so I agreed to a private arrangement with the ex. I also believe 18% per child is too much - good budgeting and thrifty practices especially when there's more than one child means a sliding scale would be realistic. The ex refused to pay anything in spite of my giving him an "out" from CSA and requested a reasonable amount, but C'link calculated as though he was so docked my pay. I was very poor and couldn't get a job.

    Eventually I was forced by Centrelink to contact CSA. They made an error, charging him far too much which I didn't think was fair on the ex (even though he's a very nasty person) and it was endangering me as the ex joined the CSA in abusing me. I told them it was wrong 3 times but they ignored me.

    Thus began the ex's violence towards them and more at me. He eventually worked for a company and was paid in his aunty's ABN number - went underground.

    He still makes me out to be the traditional "bitch" - won't let him see the children and many more lies, all to justify his not paying a cent. In the end the CSA bullied ME to find him, get money from him and so on. They kept checking my bank accounts, asking about transfers, calling me and being very nasty. They did nothing for me at all except cause a lot of problems.

    It's almost ten years ago now that I insisted I be exempted from collecting CS. It was safer and got rid of the CSA who did nothing but abuse and pressure me and treat me like a criminal. The ex thinks the CSA can sweep his tax cheques to give to his children so he hasn't put in his taxes for a decade. He'd get enough to buy a house as he's on a very high income. We're still on a low income but without the CSA in our lives, it's bliss.

    So please keep in mind fellahs that the CSA abuses and uses everyone. There are people who do the wrong thing for sure but I'm suspicious that a lot of problems between couples are actually created by the CSA themselves but the ex's don't know that so blame their ex.

    I despise the CSA.

    1440. By: Paul Siegman from Victoria, Australia on November 23, 2016 @ 11:18 pm
    Everyone I have spoken to says dhs child support ways are criminal and I agree 110%. I'm going to loose my home I have worked all my life for because of their inhumanity. All men and many woman disagree with the child support ways so why the fuck are we sitting here winging about it when we should be all getting together and fixing this life destroying law? Who is going to argue with 80% of Australia? We can make it right for us all.
    By: Oscar from SA, Australia on November 23, 2016 @ 7:37 pm

    I have just been through this process, but where I lodged the COA under 8A and 8B. if you want to give me some contact details, I will have a chat with you about the process and what happened at each stage (regarding provision of information and documents etc and the CSA processes).

    Happy to assist if I can.
    By: Rob from Vic, Aust on November 23, 2016 @ 12:06 pm

    Nothing stops you getting advice on what you intend to submit before you submit anything, if you can afford it. Don't talk to them, do it all in writing.
    By: Ian King from QLD, Australia on November 22, 2016 @ 8:46 pm

    Hi Jimmy,

    I find it ironic that a C.O.A. can be submitted with both a Reason 8A and Reason 8B at the same time. Reason 8A is "we think you are earning more than you are declaring" and Reason 8B is "we think you are not earning as much as you should be". The irony seems to escape the CSA however.

    With regards your questions :
    If you don't communicate with them, they will just escalate the case without your involvement anyhow. Unless you are planning on emigrating, or living 'outside' the system, I don't know if ignoring them serves any purpose. They will not go away.

    However, if you do choose to communicate with them, then I would suggest :
    [a] Do not give them any information over the phone. Insist that all requests for information are sent via mail, and only reply by mail. This way you will have an audit trail.
    [b] Volunteer as little information as possible. Anything that they are legally allowed to request, such as bank statements, they can obtain directly from your bank themselves. This initial part of the process is a "Fishing Expedition". They are trying to gather as much information about you as possible, so they can "cherry pick" pieces that suite their objective. Dont give it to them voluntarily.
    [c] Be aware that information that you volunteer will be given to your ex-spouse. They will most certainly not ask her for the same level of disclosure.
    [d] The reason I suggest volunteering as little information as possible, is that in my particular case, I gave them everything they asked for throughout the process. By the time I had completed the objection, review and AAT process, I had over 600 pages of documentation. This in response to 2 pages of statements from my ex, which initiated the C.O.A. If you have to involve a lawyer later on in the process, the fewer documents you have, the cheaper and better it will be.
    [e] Request a reference number for each conversation with them and keep a log of these. However, do not rely on their call recordings. These are conveniently lost when it suites them.

    You are not allowed representation at this point in the process.

    You should submit your Tax Return.

    Do you see your children and do you have a parenting plan in place ? The "Care Percentage" variable in the formula can make just as large an impact on you support payments.

    Good Luck
    By: Jimmy from QLD, Australia on November 22, 2016 @ 4:50 pm
    Here is my letter from the CSA. Please give me thoughts.
    1. Call them or not
    2. I am not allowed representation, true or false
    3. recent years I was 3.5K a month so I left Australia. Last tax return showed 20K earnings, do you think due to the fact I have not done my last tax return while not working it will be increased to 3.5K a month again.


    Dear Jimmy, We are writing to you to advise we have received a Change of Assessment application from C..... We have an address for you, via the Child Support Consulting in South Australia, but we are required to speak to you, not your representative during this process. Note: You cannot be represented by a solicitor or another person during the change of assessment process. While an authorised representative may make simple enquiries on your behalf or explain certain limited information, they cannot act on your behalf during this process. With regards to the Change of Assessment application, C..... has applied under Reason 8A & Reason 8B. A copy of C........ application and all supporting documents have been forwarded to Child Support Consulting address, including a response form and a reply paid envelope. We would like you to participate in this process, so if you respond verbally via telephone, or online, or in writing could you please fill in the response form and send any evidence to support your income. We are yet to receive a 2015/2016 tax return from the Australian Taxation Office (ATO) for yourself, could you please provide income details for this period and also the current 2016/2017 period. This will assist in making a correct decision in relation to your income for this process. Please note the open exchange of information means all parties have the opportunity to respond and comment on the information used by the decision maker. Your personal and confidential information contained on pages 5 and 6 of the Information and Privacy section will not be given to the other party. Documents cannot be exchanged after a change of assessment decision has been made. You can access your Child Support online account through myGov. MyGov is a fast and secure way to access a range of government services online with one username and password. You can create a myGov account and link it to your Child Support online account. We look forward to hearing from you, Regards Warren
    By: robin from New South Wales, Australia on November 22, 2016 @ 10:57 am
    Aj and other fathers
    A question a lot of fathers talk about killing themselfs as its the only way out of the CSA circle my question would be what would the mother tell the kids " sorry daddy killed himself as he didnt want to pay csa no more "
    Not really fair on the kids is it to grow up thinking that?
    Im not being rude or anything Im fighting them myself to get whats far for my kids and my partner is fighting them too but he went to court and still going throu court just is he would never even think about killing himself over it his kid means the world to him CSA ex bitch gf or not
    By: Sammy from vic, aust on November 21, 2016 @ 8:18 pm
    Keep with us AJ + anyone else who feels that way. I am in my 50s + been down the dark side many times, close to death i can tell you + glad i made it through, although i am still picking up the pieces many years on. Don't give any of these assholes the pleasure of seeing us MEN give up + give our dignity away no matter what they strip from us. They're all causing harm + committing crimes + many know it. We should be using the Crimes Acts 1914 (cth) + 1958(vic) + commercial liens to put all these scumbags behind bars + seize their assets, like they do to us.

    CSA rules
    1. Don't ever enter into any agreement with agents of CSA (ie. no applications, agreements or phone contact). Don't fall for their nice as pie routine at the start so they can form an agreement, which is their aim. They absolutely don't give a f*ck about you + that's all you have to understand + remember.
    2. Always reject/decline[rebut] their offers or counter offer with big charges if they want to do business with you. Use conditional acceptance.
    3. Learn what commercial agreements + contracts are.
    4. Always seek proof of any debt incl. copy of any contract with all the essential elements, actual accounting + signed invoice/affidavit showing exchange of value.
    5. Learn how to deal with debt commercially with limited liability + as MAN with unlimited liability. Any debt no matter how big can always be discharged by signing the back of the original charging instrument, if they ever took it to court. Just don't argue + keep in honour. Their whole system is contracts.

    All their games are FRAUD + commercial law. Time to take off the rose coloured glasses + research + research. They prey on our ignorance + emotional obfuscation + the fact our animal brains wanna punch their heads in cos of the wrong they perpetuate -- the whole industry of theft..

    MAN created entity/fiction (ie. CSA)

    Who has the supreme authority,, Man or CSA?
    By: AJ from W.A, Australia on November 21, 2016 @ 6:18 pm
    I feel everybody's pain here, I really do.

    Now I am getting really concerned for myself though, and I don't know what to do....

    I will still have to pay these criminals until about 2018. Hopefully, I will then clear up my "fake debt". But by then, I'm assuming that no bank is going to give me a mortgage of any kind at all. :-( because I turn 50 in January 2017.

    I swear, it makes me want to go out and do something criminal.

    I could try to get a cheaper place to live in the Philippines (so I can be with my youngest daughter) but I've looked, and I'm still looking at about $150,000 for something in her small town.

    I honestly think that the only way I'm going to set a future for my youngest, is to kill myself in a few years, and hope that my insurance and Super can cover things for her.

    Interesting that CSA "cunts" are the biggest cause of male suicide in Australia, but nobody say a fucking word. Also weird that as I'm getting older, I am fearing death less and less. But that's another story......
    By: LAT74 from WA, Australia on November 21, 2016 @ 11:39 am
    Hi all, having recently only found this site (amongst others) I have read the majority of comments and found many with the same fears and anxieties I and my second family have! My story begins some years ago in the UK with my ex de-facto and I having a daughter, I was warned she liked getting pregnant early in the relationship (2 previous to 2 different fathers) and subsequently witnessed first hand how manipulating she was, glad I was on her side right? When it was my turn for the scrap heap she traded me in for her first daughter's (16 years old) 24 year old boyfriend, the 16 year old daughter and I were asked to find new places to live!! MY daughter was 3 years old and found herself without a Father. Access was simple, pay as you payment she doesn't go! I had no parental responsibility, no home, no money (ex had conveniently 3 days before throwing me out emptied the joint accounts) As the days and weeks passed I was forced to pay half the mortgage, all the bills otherwise I didn't see her, if I turned up without money the door was slammed in my face with a screaming child the on the other side wanting to see her Daddy. Needless to say I spent about 10k (pounds) to get access, she still didn't let me see her, solicitors even said no judge will hold a mother in contempt and send her to jail as that is not in the best interests of the child!!!! During this I was arrested for her accusing me of sexually assaulting her 16 year old daughter....more court appearances, more crocodile tears, judge had no option but to deny me access as the assault case was ongoing! 2 years later I finally get supervised visits....the arresting officer rang the court to say "if it wasn't a waste of police resources my ex would be arrested and charged with wasting police time, this man deserves to see his daughter" I was of course cleared of any accusation and following supervised visits did I get to see her....of course not!! I finally decided to leave it all behind, if my daughter wanted to see me I would wait until she is 18, old enough to seek me out and tell the truth, I couldn't deal with the anguish and torture any more! I moved to Australia, have a new wife and 3 year old and my UK daughter is 14, I pay $1400 per month and she has made contact which is a great blessing. I cannot see her as she is to afraid to tell her mother and I cannot afford to fight it, or bring her over, the payments are destroying my 2nd family, I am paying them on a credit card. Despite my daughter being in the UK I am part of the Australian system, payments go up when turned 13, withhold childcare rebate if you don't get your tax return done, value my 3 year old less than my 14 year old!! I went missing on Saturday afternoon with a bottle of booze and a lonely beach presented itself, I was ready to walk in and end it all! If I moved back I would pay less even if I didn't see her, thankfully I didn't do it but the thoughts are there. The CSA last week told me when I asked them to justify "Why" teenage girls need more things like make up and toiletries, why does the UK government not take this into account lady CSA worker....?? She understands she says but unfortunately blah blah....I tell them, my child is too afraid to tell her mother she wants to see me, now knows I pay for her, CSA lady says "a child doesn't need to know you pay for her" I've written to the mother, see where that ends....thank you for reading
    By: Rob Bed from Vic, Australia on November 21, 2016 @ 4:24 am
    Watch out for the end of school dates, especially if you have multiple kids. My ex constantly put in an extra month to CSA, ring the school and find out the exact date school finishes, MAKE AN OBJECTION if the date is wrong.... and what was the punishment for HER lying? nothing... Female privilege by the Govt in this country has to stop.
    1430. By: Kris from nsw, ZOG on November 20, 2016 @ 8:48 pm
    Hi to all paying parents,
    Dont ever talk to those fks at csa, if you do dont ever tell them anything especially your marital status. Do they tell you your exs marital status? Everything is privacy regarding her but not YOU. They are profiling you analyzing you and sooner or later will fk you.
    And regarding not saying anything bad about your ex infront of your kids...
    I don't buy that crap,
    When the time is right ,the truth should not be hidden or diluted.
    And in my case it probably wont matter anyway. With the amount of poison,isolation and lies my ex has fed my son he most likely wont even want to know me soon. But hey who am I but a sponsor.
    Solicitors are disgusting maggots/rats dressed in suits to look more appealing.

    By: Neil Bennett from NSW, Australia on November 20, 2016 @ 10:32 am
    CSA .....CANNOT.... take money from a spouses bank account unless they (CSA) PROVE in a court that that father has transfered that money to you and the court agrees and makes a judgement in their favourite. But be aware that if they are chasing your husband then they are looking into your finances in the background as well. My wife and I have had 20 years of this shit. My wife has a file with them and only found out through FOI. But there a ways around it. Husband owns a company....said company pays said wife...get creative people. Use the law as they use it against you. Don't fall for their bullying as that is all it is. The worst they can do is stop you leaving Australia...DPO. they CANNOT jail you for not paying child support
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